Radios for ACP 16 activities

[ALJ23]

Hi everyone - our Squadron has raised some money and we are looking to purchase some hand held radios we can use when out and about doing ACP 16 stuff.

My thoughts were to get a really good waterproof set for Staff use with headsets / ear pieces, and possibly a cheaper set for the cadets to use ?

Can anyone recomend any good ones we can use ? I would guess we need a decent range on them,

Any thoughts and pointers would be good ?

Many thanks

AJ

[paul_brown]

hi at my sqn we got our radios from consam.com they are based in leister and sell of recon units that have previously been on long term hire or you can get some new ones, they have quite a good range and will proggramme them to the frequency that you want, my sqn went for icom which have served us well and are only requiring new batteries after 10 years of service.

[Vhfcomm]

Few radios are truly waterproof, but most ex police/ambulance/fire service ones are moisture proof. We've got Motorola MT600 and recently bought some MT6000's(?) from Radioswap.com. The problem with second hand radios is to make sure the batteries are not second hand, other wise they may not hold a full charge. My recent purchase had all new batteries and came with remote speaker mics.

Consider having a more powerful "base station" to use at exercise control and equip it with a capable aerial. This should guarantee that control can be heard throughout the exercise area, even if individual handhelds cannot hear everyone else.

[Vhfcomm]

Why not just use Nokias?

Effective radio systems are not cheap and are difficult to maintain.

We have Clansman 349s and a 320, but anyone planning on using them had better take a day off to test them all and charge the batteries. And they were recently serviced!

The Motorolas are very good though. I use one at work and in 8 years of service I have never seen or heard of one fail. Voice quality is superb. I use an XT7000 on an OTAR site. But they cost us £1600 each, fully loaded with all the features!

Nokias may be reliable, but how will you contact 10 field stations simultaneously?

If you are using second hand batteries, then you will get a lot of problems. The radios themselves are generally reliable.

6 Motorola radios plus new batteries and a 6 bank charger for £300. I wouldn't call that expensive.

[Batfink]

Whilst not waterproof, you can't really go wrong with GP300's... except that they are so bombproof, few people are willing to part with them - and then they do, they cost a fair amount of spondoolies!

[ninjadingle]

I too have had good experiences with Motorolas, GP300's are great for cadets, or GP340's. Cheap accessories and easy to program to cadet frequencies if you know how

349's and 351's are good when used correctly. Remember 349's are section level radios with an output power of 1W. You can't expect them to cover any serious distance!

But please remember to buy kit that works on cadet frequencies - PMR446 maybe cheap and cheerful, but is not for use by cadets!

[leothan]

PMR446 maybe cheap and cheerful, but is not for use by cadets!

Sure? I know something to the contrary

[incubus]

PMR446 maybe cheap and cheerful, but is not for use by cadets!

Sure? I know something to the contrary

ninjadingle's comment is not particularly accurate.
Cadets can use PMR446 but for the purposes that PMR446 was designed for. Air cadet procedures (specifically "sensitive" ones like callsigns, authentication and codex) cannot be used on PMR446 for security reasons.

[Burnie]

Indeed - Air cadet callsigns, prowords, codex and authentications should not be used on PMR446

Similarly I believe I've seen somewhere that ACO frequencies should not be used for events such as ground-management/car-parking (unless properly authorised like RIAT)

For this reason our squadron has it's radios programmed for the Victor channels for radio training as well as PMR446 channels for event management.

[incubus]

Similarly I believe I've seen somewhere that ACO frequencies should not be used for events such as ground-management/car-parking (unless properly authorised like RIAT)

That isn't something I've seen or heard of and we certainly use UHF for this type of event up here. Of course, there is slim to no chance of cross-talk up here so it has never been an issue.

PMR446 is a better thing to use for the task as you can be more relaxed with the procedures and actually focus on the job rather than the protocols. You do risk every other numpty jumping on the channel though - better to have a personal channel.

In fact, if HQAC (or the radio clique at least) have an issue with car parking on standard channels, perhaps HQAC could purchase a non-mil allocated channel to be shared corps-wide and used for mundane activities. I think it would be a worthwhile use of a bit of cash.

For this reason our squadron has it's radios programmed for the Victor channels for radio training as well as PMR446 channels for event management.

I believe that the PMR446 standard is tightly regulated - you can't just programme another radio in to use their frequencies and expect the terms of the "free " licences use of that part of the spectrum to be met.

What kit do you use which can handle VHF channels and 446 on the same box?

[Burnie]

Ex-police Motorolas reprogrammed to 'whatever frequncies you want'

[ninjadingle]

To qualify my earlier post - Ofcom recommend that PMR446 should not be used for safety-of-life matters. I assumed that part of the need for radios would be for NoDuff situations as well as general control of exercises etc?

General car-parking and the like - fine, but as the OP specified ACP16 activities, that's what I based my answer on.

And Burnie - you have dual band Motorolas? (PMR is on UHF, yet you claim to also have Victor (VHF) channels?) Didn't think Motorola did a dual band unit?

[MattB]

Is there a specific ATC ban on using them in such situations though? The combination of PMR and mobile 'phones should privide adquate cover for a relatively low-risk activity such as FCT.

[Burnie]

And Burnie - you have dual band Motorolas? (PMR is on UHF, yet you claim to also have Victor (VHF) channels?) Didn't think Motorola did a dual band unit?

I don't know - I haven't had a play on the radios yet but my radio officer informs me that we have had them programmed for ACO channels and civvie channels

[Vhfcomm]

According to Ofcom rules, as I understand it, licence free 446 channels can only be used by type approved equipment, i.e. equipment designed to meet the specifications of the 446 allocation. Reprogramming of other equipment to work on 446 channels, or modifying 446 equipment is not allowed.